I have just left all the calls for all the 8 (well, two mail banks were full) and I was sitting here—deflated, paralyzed—just waiting for you, Simon, to make this day a little better. Thank you for coming in a little earlier than usual and making it possible for me to stand up and — I don't know, do some mindless work? — before I call the 8 again.
One of those two banks that were full was my senator's line, Maggie Hassan of NH. I was calling on another issue. I should've known something was up right then.
Simon --- I'm furious. I'm in a rage --- fucked over by 8 Dems?? Really. To think for a nanosecond that the republicans will honor their 'promise' - with fingers crossed behind their backs is the height of utter lunacy. We had the high road (I know we still do) and the criminals, all of them, were getting blamed. It makes me sick ---- sick. I've written them all - their voice mails are full ---- Please - everyone - do the same -- flood their phones and emails!!!!!!
The fact that they will betray us on the ACA subsidies works in our favor. They will have to run on their horrendous policies in the midterms. I was also furious last night! But I’m not going without a paycheck or food for my kids. The worst that would happen is I won’t see my kid for the holidays. Will this be harder to win? Probably. But never forget that Trump is willing to be indefinitely cruel to our fellow Americans. And the GOP is feckless and cowardly enough to allow it. We might not have won this anyway because they wouldn’t care if there were bodies in the streets. There is a way forward here. We need to push our representatives to get it together especially in the messaging. We cannot fail at that. Stay with us and help.
Unless I am misunderstanding what they "promised", it will be easy for them to fulfill it. Didn't they simply promise a vote at a later date on reinstating the ACA subsidies? That vote would need 60 for cloture so it's purely going through the motions on a vote everyone knows is going to fail.
Am I wrong, there is no obligation that the house vote on reinstating the ACA subsidies? It would at least have some political benefit to force a stand alone vote in the house. It might even pass in the house. I don't think the "deal" secures a house vote on reinstating the ACA subsidies. Correct me if I am wrong.
You are not wrong. I'm saying that the fact that they made the empty "promise"yet will ultimately do nothing to help people faced with sky high premiums is something we can point to. Another GOP lie, the rich are doing fine, you have lost your health insurance kind of message. Our messaging has not been great, and in the face of this recent vote it looks even worse. I refuse to let the GOP use my anger to widen the fracture created yesterday. We can be mad but we must stay unified and on message. If we jump ship they win. Like Simon said, some may need to step back for a bit. I'm hoping everyone comes back when they are ready.
Good call. We need to stay unified because they would love for us to fracture, and we can't give them that satisfaction. The Republicans have become cruel beyond their wildest dreams. Somehow, we have to hold their feet to the fire and throw their lies back in their faces. I'm sick of feeling like I'm going to throw up every time I read the news. My mother-in-law had an apt expression: "You can lock out a thief, but not a liar."
I'm furious too and just called my two misguided senators; didn't know if it would make a difference to call the others when we're not their constituents....
You are not alone, my friend! We all need to take a deep breath and say the Serenity Prayer! Then, we need to keep going forward by working hard in our pro democracy efforts. Support pro democracy organizations like Democracy Forward, ACLU, etc….
Support our food banks and neighbors as much as we are able. Most importantly, don’t let anyone still your joy! We will never give up!!!!!
I can't say words strong enough to ask that we NOT split the Democratic message or party if some Democrat Senators finally agree to open the government. Find the middle ground here!! Someone had to budge, and there are promises to keep. We'll see if the GOP can do that.
We all should know by now that the Republicans in Congress cannot be trusted. They have demonstrated this many times already. The only weapon Senate Dems had to fight back was the filibuster, and with last night's vote, they put down that weapon. You can't appease a bully. Bullies respond to strength, not weakness. My opinion is that if ALL Senate Dems had stayed firm, the GOP would have been forced to negotiate a resolution that included extension of the ACA subsidies. It was the fact that some Senate Dems were wavering that caused Rs to hold out till they caved.
We cannot split the party. What we need right now is a strategy. We have a lot of spirit, but we need a unifying approach that offers a direct, powerful, and honest message to the American people to counter the MAGA noise, lies, and spin.
Do agree with you Susan. I know the Senators who didn’t vote with the 8 must be massively disappointed but expect them not to give up but to keep fighting and strategizing. My hope is, like yours, we continue to support them and each other. 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
I messaged my senators Dick Durbin and Tammy Duckworth late last night after news reports that a vote would take place. This morning I call Durbin's office to express my outrage at his betrayal -- betrayal of Americans who will lose their health care, betrayal of Americans who voted for Democrats in huge numbers last Tuesday, and for wasting 40 days of a government shutdown, putting down the only tool available to Dems (the filibuster).
They gained NOTHING in return. You can't just talk the talk. You have to walk the walk. Dems have lost a ton of credibility with last night's vote.
Let's put pressure on the remaining Dems to vote NO when the bill comes up for a full Senate vote. Let's show that it was only a handful of misguided Democrats who caved. Let's show that all the others stood firm.
I emailed Senators Durbin and Duckworth this morning, after reading about the vote. I told Durbin that I have voted for him in every single election, but I am furious and ashamed that he gave in, relying on a regime that lies, lies, lies. Thank goodness he is retiring! And it's SO important to also express gratitude---which went to our other Illinois Senator, Tammy Duckworth. I told her how proud I am of her integrity and strength of character, in this and on so many other issues. We WILL prevail!
I am thankful to Sen. Duckworth. Durbin should have retired a few decades ago and been replaced by someone younger. But I am thankful for what he typically did.
I live in MD and have called both my Senators and my Representative- none of whom support this Senate “deal”.
Is there no chance to dissuade the “hateful eight” here? Aren’t there multiple votes required for this cave-in deal to move forward through the Senate?
Democrats picked the ACA hill to fight and die on and now they’ve just abandoned the hill and the fight completely and, at least to my eye, all they got for their efforts was a handful of magic beans. Feels like they sold the milk cow for some magic beans and they expected the rest of us to praise them for it
Simon, I am so enraged I can barely speak. After all the time, energy and resources we poured into last week’s across the board victories, less than a week later, our own people stab us in the back. This is so demoralizing and a betrayal of the American people who were counting on them to hold the line. How could they?!
I'm frustrated too, but remember these are only 8 (at least a couple of whom should be primaried), and the house IS NOT on the same page with this vote. I think it helps if you look at this as a battle - albeit one we may lose (which does suck). Remember the bigger picture - the war - which we CAN and MUST still win. It's honestly impressive Schumer displayed as much of a spine as he did for as long as he did in this situation. The reality is, the "fighters" we all want in the Democratic leadership will be there with new leadership.
Of the eight, only Durbin and Shaheen are done their terms and they have both announced they are not running for reelection. The other six are not up in 2026. Double cowards.
we cant keep waiting to install new, energized, younger, more aggressive leaders in the house and the senate! if you want to send a signal, that's how you do it. a complete top to bottom shake up. i agree this was staged. i always expected them to fold. not shocked at all. in fact surprised they lasted this long. they are not fighters anymore. been in DC too long. lost touch with the people. and schumer is milk toast thru and thru.
We just have to stay energized, inspired and creat the biggest bluest most progressive tsunami we can next year. Let these milquetoast senators not halt what has started - and accelerated last week!
A road map on how to demoralize your base. Show some fight (finally) only to completely cave and get nothing. Makes us feel like this was orchestrated from the start, that it was all theater. They knew they would just cave but wanted our energy, our money and our votes in the meantime. The fact that there is exactly 60 votes for this cloture proves that this was completely orchestrated by leadership. Apparently they think we are stupid.
For the life of me, I don't get how they do not understand that inflating expectations with a lot of "fight" talk to then cave in the end in what apparently was likely an orchestrated foregone conclusion. This deflates enthusiasm in the base more than just voting for cloture in the first place. All the while getting bombarded for more and more campaign contributions, multiple requests a day.
Here’s another suggestion: send some money to John Ossoff, who’s actually up for reelection next year and DID NOT cave, unlike the cowardly and politically foolish Dems that did.
I send a small amount $15 monthly to Ossoff and was going to pull it if he went with the Cavers. Grateful he did not and have emailed him so, given the very purple nature of his State.
OK, I've been awake now for about 4 hours and have had a little time to absorb this news. I guess where I stand is where I've stood since the Senate voted for reconciliation in the Spring. Now, more than ever, I feel that Senate Democrats need to vote for a leadership change ASAP. Not only has the leadership been unable to hold the caucus together, they've actively led us to this moment. Schumer (among others) voted for reconciliation, and Durbin was among last night's group of eight. This simply can not continue if we hope to maintain an energized electorate. Millions of people like me fought long and hard for last Tuesday's result, and we deserve leadership in the mold of a Churchill or Roosevelt, not Chamberlain.
Schumer came out against it. So there is that. Unfortunately he’s not as effective a whip like Pelosi was. We will see how the next few months go though…
Hi Jon. Durbin is the whip and is retiring. Given that his clock is ticking down, I feel that he should simply step aside for the good of the caucus. As for Schumer, he's the face of the Senate Democratic caucus. And, for better or (mostly) worse, and the optics here are simply awful.
It only took 1 week & 7 Sen Dems to inflict chaos in our united front to stand up for keeping ACA, SNAP, Medicaid benefits, fight against tyranny, corruption, rule of law, expansion of ICE, our neighbors and their children being physically abused and/or disappeared, etc etc...feel free to add to the list--
I agree that he should. The optics, at least among the base, aren't good and the point of having experienced legislators like Schumer and Durbin in the party doesn't help if they can't fight either (at the same time, just having a fighter isn't going to work either...they need no kidding experience but that's another convo for another time).
As for the "normie" American voter though, that I'm not worried about in this case. They're not as online as we are and they will blame the incumbent party for their suffering as they've done so many times, most recently last Tuesday as they had in 2024.
Hi Jon. I agree with what you've written, but I also feel that we're living in a unique moment, when people who typically stay on the sidelines know that they need to get out this time around. I'll put myself forward as an example. I'm (mostly) a high information voter, but I'm not terribly comfortable going out to protest. That all changed this year. I certainly won't speak for the 7+ million people who protested a few weeks ago, but I don't think that yesterday's maneuver by the 8 Senators is going to cause many of us to fold up our tents and go away!
Yep! I'm AD military though so I'm a bit more careful about what I participate in, and what I don't, but i completely agree.
We do have to remember that we the terminally politically online aren't necessarily representative of the American voter writ large. And the good thing about midterms next year is that the local candidate counts too, and that helps stave off the damage.
I agree with you. This is the first time in a long time that the American people have been mobilized to defend their country and the institutions upon which it was founded. What I experienced at the marches was solidarity and determination in the face of cruelty, abuse, and deceit.
While I agree most are not as plugged in as some are here, narrative and perception matters. At social events such as showers, coffee get togethers, etc. I hear over and over how the Dems are weak and what’s the point in fighting bc they will just fold. While I don’t say oh that’s not true, because that is what they believe and I don't want to dismiss it, I do say, we have to keep voting. Last week was an enormous boost. Yesterday, was demoralizing. While most may continue to vote, will they be energized enough to believe in the Party and protest and volunteer? More importantly, will they try to get their friends and family to believe and act? Will new voters continue to vote? Huge step backwards. I won't give up and most of us here won't. Schumer just made it harder. I, honestly, believe it's time for him and others who are not up to current challenges to step down. I hope Schumer resigns in a digniied manner. JMO
Honestly, this just caused me more frustration (and anger). IF Schumer was truly against it, then he can't hold his caucus together. If he thought he could fool most of us by voting no into thinking he wasn't behind this, he is sorely mistaken. I am in the latter category.
I don't think he actually can hold his caucus like Pelosi or other past leaders could. This is one of those "Hanlon's Razors" moments where Schumer doesn't mean ill, but isn't effective here.
Pelosi stood up to those in Obama's circle that did not want him to fight for the ACA. She knew it risked her Speakership but pushed forward anyway. At least, that is what has been written about it. Harry Reid also fought for the ACA.
Okay, I just had time to look up what "Hanlon's Razor's" means. Ahhhh:
"Hanlon's Razor is an adage that states, 'Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity'. It is a reminder to consider incompetence, error, or carelessness as the cause of a negative event before assuming the person acted with malicious intent".
Interesting theory, hmm. I don't think Schumer is stupid but I see your point here. AI went on to explain further but that was the gist of the explanation. I think Schumer is just not the right person/Senator to lead for this time in history.
Agree 100%. Durbin is the Whip for the Democratic Caucus. He is not voting for this unless Schumer allowed him to do so (he’s the number 2 leader of the caucus and is not going to undermine the leader for a vote of this magnitude). Also, they did this on a Sunday because they knew it would infuriate the base but viewed that as an acceptable cost for whatever goal they were seeking (and sought to bury the vote on a slow news day). I’m the same age as Simon and actually worked in the Senate (as an LA) and have been involved in Congressional issues for many years afterwards. I say this because I think Simon is right that Durbin and the others are by no means corrupt personally but I will say it is very likely they were heavily influenced by lobbyists and consultants in their decision making (and valued that input over the concerns of Democratic voters) and there is something pretty wrong, and corrupt, in that calculus and it is a reason for a change.
Thanks for your perspective from the "inside," Lojo. I just got done talking with a friend who also strongly feels that Schumer had to be part of the decision making process here. Anyway, both my friend and I are righteously displeased and feel more determined than ever to move forward to see the change we need to put this lunacy in the rearview mirror. And, for us, that means both winning future elections AND real change in the party to a leadership that, at the very least, comprehends the will of the voters a mere 5 days after a wave election!!!
I agree it was choreographed. However I would submit that Schumer likely had support from more than the 8. The 8 could take the heat because they were retiring or not up for re-election. I would bet there were others who supported the deal but did not want to face the backlash, which would have come.
Also Matthew Yglesias (Slow Money) thinks a lot of this was about preserving the filibuster
In any case, the Dems were pushed by us to do something they didn’t want to do, and made a point , and were not blamed like they feared
As Simon mentioned, more fights ahead and something to build on
Yes, state what we are for very completely. Another aspect, part of what came up re: unrolling the tariffs, is some outline of how we disassemble the corruption. On the legal side there's plenty of excellent discussion - top notch legal minds laying out what must be done - but for the government as a whole, how to we get there from here, and by getting there I mean build back better, as it were. Knowing one or several paths ahead will be a big help, imo.
one of my slogans: frogs united to help friends in other ponds
Yes the Dems let us down. Yes we are angry. But let's not forget that the difference between Schumer supporting the CR in March and the longest shutdown in history was We the People standing up and demanding that Dems fight. They did fight, up to a point, and not far or hard enough. But we made progress. Now we must push Dems (and Rs where possible) even harder. In all likelihood we will be back here in December over the ACA and in January over the budget. We have to keep fighting and keep demanding that Dems do MUCH better.
I think the concern being expressed extensively today is that the "fight" was pure theater. That the Democratic leadership knew that, in the end, they would just cave and vote for cloture and reopen the government. I guess some of us are questioning the sincerity of the "fight" that leadership was demonstrating.
You know the town better than I do, so I'll take your word for it. I'm not sure the observation is ridiculous, however. There is, unfortunately, a history of not putting up much of a fight on these matters, including earlier this year. Leadership knew they had to "show" some determination this time around. Orchestrating a tidy end to the shut down after a very strong Democratic performance last week, to me, is a bit baffling. Which leads me to the conclusion that they possibly were using the energy of the shutdown for base politics without the resolve to truly take heat when the going got tough and continue to fight for what they said they were fighting for.
I agree with you, Simon, that they didn't intend this to be performative. The best proof of that (to me) is that there was real risk to the Dems of doing what they did, risks no one would take just to be performative, eg (1) It was all too easy to paint the Dems as responsible for the shutdown--it was clearly their Senate votes that were responsible (just as, in the past, GOP votes were deemed the culprit by the public)--and significantly harder to logically make the claim (to the less engaged who represent the balance of power) that the GOP was to blame; (2) It was all too easy for the GOP to tar the Dems as hypocrites given that every past shutdown, all of which the GOP was blamed for, originated from the GOP's refusal to pass clean CRs, which they would now be doing as well (3) They knew the GOP had a huge informational advantage in making their case, not only by virtue of having the guy who dominates every news cycle, but a guy they had to know would be willing to break any and every law to enhance that advantage (eg by violating the Hatch Act on every government website), and a corporate media that has been in the tank for him at every level--national, state, and local--since he descended that escalator in 2015 (4) These risks were turbocharged by the fact that they were making the decision to fight against the backdrop of a series of rapidly approaching elections that were must-win for us, not so much for them (ie they had to know the GOP would be able to dismiss losses in all the highest profile contests as taking place in "blue states and blue cities," and that our ill-informed electorate would have no reason to dismiss their dismissal).
For many of the same reasons, I believe we can't really dismiss the decision to "cave" as venal rather than heartfelt (if mistaken) either. We won the elections handily; the public had clearly decided the Republicans were to blame for the shutdown; the pressure on the eight, if any, was to stay the course, not to give in; none of eight were up for re-election in 2026, two of the eight were retiring. If they say they couldn't deal with the pain being inflicted on innocent people any more, that not only has to be considered the gospel truth, but even at least somewhat refreshing, given the history of our politics since Newt stormed into the Speaker's chair. It might even, outside our base, restore a little faith that at least some of our politicians actually care about the people as something more than vehicles for scoring political points, and a less cynical American public is not only important for America, but for the world, which has long relied on our can-do spirit.
All that said, I find myself wondering how and why the Dems in the Senate didn't anticipate that Trump would start "shooting the hostages," as you put it. I guess maybe I'm spoiled by how far ahead of them *you've* been since Day 1 of Trump 2, and because I've learned from you--we all have--that when it comes to Trump, to expect even worse than you can imagine, as well as how critical it is to understand how high the stakes are--we're not in a territory where we can be cute; the winner vs loser is a uniquely American dynamic inherent to the self-selection process that brought us here (which, until you took the risks *you* did in 2022, only the GOP seemed to understand), and strong vs weak is *always* the table stakes in the fight between autocracy and democracy.
For me personally, what you've taught about this in an American context has resonated down to the marrow, as the son of a father who grew up under Hitler and Stalin, and the grandson of a core minister in Boenhoffer's Confessing Church who got thrown in prison for preaching against Hitler during the war.
Any thoughts on why *they* didn't have a plan B? Fortunately, as another member put it, you're already giving us our own ways to make lemonade from these unusually sour lemons. :)
I’m not sure how much sincerity matters here. It seems clear that many Republicans in congress are not sincere in their support of Trump. It is expedient. If we can make it expedient for Dems to fight a lot harder for us by showing that they will lose elections if they don’t I think I can accept that.
Yeah that’s a go-to narrative that we all just have to be ready for. “Dems are performative” is a trope that gets trotted out at every opportunity. Watch out for 🇷🇺 in the comments out there (not on Hopium, but like, you know, social media in general).
Fetterman constituents here and have been furious for some time and been contacting his voicemail. What can PA patriots do about him in particular? We did not vote for a Manchin in our state.
Fetterman loves going rogue, and unfortunately I thought that trait meant he would stand up to authoritarianism. Clearly I was wrong. He goes rogue to go rogue. I send vibes into the universe for him to retire so we can have an early election and get a fighter in there. I feel your frustration and disgust, and in spite of these emotions I will continue to call and demand courage in the face of this regime.
Trump's assault on federal workers in this region has been savage all year and people hurting here, terribly. People have been fired. Their lives wildly disrupted. And now folks aren't getting paid. The entire region has been under assault and imagine missing three paychecks on a government salary. We now have the highest unemployment rate in the country, the national guard is patrolling our streets, etc.
To add to Simon's point, I worked the polls last week here in Arlington, VA (a very affluent neighborhood) and all I heard from the folks who wanted to talk was about the Shutdown. How it affected their neighbors -- pointing to houses down the street -- their friends, their friends' kids, and even themselves. Some of us can bear this, but many cannot. As someone said, people need to be paid and be fed. I guess that's what we have to think about....despite my previous post above -- I am still very disheartened.
I find the Democrats' (the 8 of them)action so hard to believe, to accept. But I have two other thoughts. I know Tim Kaine to be intelligent, thoughtful and reasonable. He must have had a good reason to vote as he did. Second, regardless we can't give up. We still have our huge victory on Election Day. That is what we need to remember and we need to keep fighting.
Virginia - I also admire Tim Kaine and saw a clip of him last night explaining his vote. I'm disappointed too, and had it been up to me, we would have held our ground. The truth is that it wasn't up to any of us, it was up to our elected representatives and a small number of them broke with the caucus to do what they felt was best. It feels like a betrayal this morning, but we have to move on knowing that kids will be fed, people will get their paychecks and there will be more hills to die on before we win at least the House back in 26. We must claim the win for being the adults in the room who ended the shutdown and move on to the next battle. My random thoughts - and I understand others' anger. Kent
And what will we do the next time the Republicans pull a fast one like this? It is transparently obvious that Trump knows he can push at least some of the Democrats over the brink by simply acting as illegally and cruelly as he has done here. Does anyone think that Republicans will vote to restore SNAP funding and extend the ACA premium subsidies, now that they’ve gotten essentially every thing they wanted? Why should they? They know that whenever they want to they can put the screws to the Democrats and the American people, and expect that some Democrats will fold again, just like they did in March and now in November.
I don't expect MAGA to ever do the right thing or to honor their promises. I wouldn't have caved if I had been there. But they did, so we may as well look forward and focus on how we message this. (We can also decide to primary anyone we want to, plan for winning next November, and fight them again in January when the CR comes up again.)
We just had some hugely major wins on our scoreboard. Huge. Massive. Wins that show the mind of the voters. Wins that have immense value. The alarm has been sounded. Even the rural states have become engaged. Now we work together for more and more of these. For more exposing of this regime. The alternative is unacceptable. IMO we focus our anger on our opponents who are damaging our democracy. We focus our anger on protecting our democracy for our children and grandchildren.
I feel betrayed. And I’m not alone. ‘We the People’ held up our end. We called, we wrote, we contributed, we rallied and we voted. We sent a crystal clear message to Washington and to our elected representatives that we won’t cave to a king.
Then 8 of them sold us out.
For the first time in almost a year we had some leverage, we held the cards and we folded.
Once again the old adage that Democrats bring pillows to gun fights applies and it’s true.
I feel so adrift today. I hate MAGA and I’m pissed as hell at Democrats. For the first time in almost 2 years I feel like quitting.
I’m hoping someone (you Simon?) can find a way to put lipstick on this pig.
This morning one of the major headlines read:
“Democrats are divided.”
And this comes not a week after we voted unanimously up and down ballot in unity!
I hope you don't quit Judy. Our party is large, messy and a big tent. Personally, I'm pissed at this too - as are the house democrats - but remember this is but one battle. With new leadership will come more "fighters" we all want in our party. As for the "Dems" are divided headline, what else did you expect from corporate media ?
I appreciate your support. But in this case I don’t think the headlines are wrong. Go to Dick Durban’s FB page and read the responses. Just one example of many left leaning pages. We shouldn’t have to be clawing back support with Democratic constituents. I think that’s gonna suck up a lot of energy better spent elsewhere.
Please, I need the listening arrow! 🎧
I have just left all the calls for all the 8 (well, two mail banks were full) and I was sitting here—deflated, paralyzed—just waiting for you, Simon, to make this day a little better. Thank you for coming in a little earlier than usual and making it possible for me to stand up and — I don't know, do some mindless work? — before I call the 8 again.
One of those two banks that were full was my senator's line, Maggie Hassan of NH. I was calling on another issue. I should've known something was up right then.
I just got through to Rosen. Left messages again for the others. Three times for Kaine.
Simon --- I'm furious. I'm in a rage --- fucked over by 8 Dems?? Really. To think for a nanosecond that the republicans will honor their 'promise' - with fingers crossed behind their backs is the height of utter lunacy. We had the high road (I know we still do) and the criminals, all of them, were getting blamed. It makes me sick ---- sick. I've written them all - their voice mails are full ---- Please - everyone - do the same -- flood their phones and emails!!!!!!
The fact that they will betray us on the ACA subsidies works in our favor. They will have to run on their horrendous policies in the midterms. I was also furious last night! But I’m not going without a paycheck or food for my kids. The worst that would happen is I won’t see my kid for the holidays. Will this be harder to win? Probably. But never forget that Trump is willing to be indefinitely cruel to our fellow Americans. And the GOP is feckless and cowardly enough to allow it. We might not have won this anyway because they wouldn’t care if there were bodies in the streets. There is a way forward here. We need to push our representatives to get it together especially in the messaging. We cannot fail at that. Stay with us and help.
Unless I am misunderstanding what they "promised", it will be easy for them to fulfill it. Didn't they simply promise a vote at a later date on reinstating the ACA subsidies? That vote would need 60 for cloture so it's purely going through the motions on a vote everyone knows is going to fail.
Am I wrong, there is no obligation that the house vote on reinstating the ACA subsidies? It would at least have some political benefit to force a stand alone vote in the house. It might even pass in the house. I don't think the "deal" secures a house vote on reinstating the ACA subsidies. Correct me if I am wrong.
You are not wrong. I'm saying that the fact that they made the empty "promise"yet will ultimately do nothing to help people faced with sky high premiums is something we can point to. Another GOP lie, the rich are doing fine, you have lost your health insurance kind of message. Our messaging has not been great, and in the face of this recent vote it looks even worse. I refuse to let the GOP use my anger to widen the fracture created yesterday. We can be mad but we must stay unified and on message. If we jump ship they win. Like Simon said, some may need to step back for a bit. I'm hoping everyone comes back when they are ready.
Good call. We need to stay unified because they would love for us to fracture, and we can't give them that satisfaction. The Republicans have become cruel beyond their wildest dreams. Somehow, we have to hold their feet to the fire and throw their lies back in their faces. I'm sick of feeling like I'm going to throw up every time I read the news. My mother-in-law had an apt expression: "You can lock out a thief, but not a liar."
🙏🏻🇺🇸
Great reminder , thank you
I'm furious too and just called my two misguided senators; didn't know if it would make a difference to call the others when we're not their constituents....
You are not alone, my friend! We all need to take a deep breath and say the Serenity Prayer! Then, we need to keep going forward by working hard in our pro democracy efforts. Support pro democracy organizations like Democracy Forward, ACLU, etc….
Support our food banks and neighbors as much as we are able. Most importantly, don’t let anyone still your joy! We will never give up!!!!!
Note that none of them are up for re-election next year. 2 are retiring. Note the $$$$ they got from the airlines for this.
It will look miserably bad for them if they back out on their promise.
I can't say words strong enough to ask that we NOT split the Democratic message or party if some Democrat Senators finally agree to open the government. Find the middle ground here!! Someone had to budge, and there are promises to keep. We'll see if the GOP can do that.
We all should know by now that the Republicans in Congress cannot be trusted. They have demonstrated this many times already. The only weapon Senate Dems had to fight back was the filibuster, and with last night's vote, they put down that weapon. You can't appease a bully. Bullies respond to strength, not weakness. My opinion is that if ALL Senate Dems had stayed firm, the GOP would have been forced to negotiate a resolution that included extension of the ACA subsidies. It was the fact that some Senate Dems were wavering that caused Rs to hold out till they caved.
Agree 💯
We cannot split the party. What we need right now is a strategy. We have a lot of spirit, but we need a unifying approach that offers a direct, powerful, and honest message to the American people to counter the MAGA noise, lies, and spin.
Do agree with you Susan. I know the Senators who didn’t vote with the 8 must be massively disappointed but expect them not to give up but to keep fighting and strategizing. My hope is, like yours, we continue to support them and each other. 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
I messaged my senators Dick Durbin and Tammy Duckworth late last night after news reports that a vote would take place. This morning I call Durbin's office to express my outrage at his betrayal -- betrayal of Americans who will lose their health care, betrayal of Americans who voted for Democrats in huge numbers last Tuesday, and for wasting 40 days of a government shutdown, putting down the only tool available to Dems (the filibuster).
They gained NOTHING in return. You can't just talk the talk. You have to walk the walk. Dems have lost a ton of credibility with last night's vote.
Let's put pressure on the remaining Dems to vote NO when the bill comes up for a full Senate vote. Let's show that it was only a handful of misguided Democrats who caved. Let's show that all the others stood firm.
I called all of them last night before the vote. For those that had full mailboxes, I emailed. I will do so again today.
I emailed Senators Durbin and Duckworth this morning, after reading about the vote. I told Durbin that I have voted for him in every single election, but I am furious and ashamed that he gave in, relying on a regime that lies, lies, lies. Thank goodness he is retiring! And it's SO important to also express gratitude---which went to our other Illinois Senator, Tammy Duckworth. I told her how proud I am of her integrity and strength of character, in this and on so many other issues. We WILL prevail!
I'm so glad to hear that Tammy Duckworth stood firm. Thank you.
I am thankful to Sen. Duckworth. Durbin should have retired a few decades ago and been replaced by someone younger. But I am thankful for what he typically did.
I live in MD and have called both my Senators and my Representative- none of whom support this Senate “deal”.
Is there no chance to dissuade the “hateful eight” here? Aren’t there multiple votes required for this cave-in deal to move forward through the Senate?
Democrats picked the ACA hill to fight and die on and now they’ve just abandoned the hill and the fight completely and, at least to my eye, all they got for their efforts was a handful of magic beans. Feels like they sold the milk cow for some magic beans and they expected the rest of us to praise them for it
Simon, I am so enraged I can barely speak. After all the time, energy and resources we poured into last week’s across the board victories, less than a week later, our own people stab us in the back. This is so demoralizing and a betrayal of the American people who were counting on them to hold the line. How could they?!
I'm frustrated too, but remember these are only 8 (at least a couple of whom should be primaried), and the house IS NOT on the same page with this vote. I think it helps if you look at this as a battle - albeit one we may lose (which does suck). Remember the bigger picture - the war - which we CAN and MUST still win. It's honestly impressive Schumer displayed as much of a spine as he did for as long as he did in this situation. The reality is, the "fighters" we all want in the Democratic leadership will be there with new leadership.
Of the eight, only Durbin and Shaheen are done their terms and they have both announced they are not running for reelection. The other six are not up in 2026. Double cowards.
"Et tu, Brute?"
we cant keep waiting to install new, energized, younger, more aggressive leaders in the house and the senate! if you want to send a signal, that's how you do it. a complete top to bottom shake up. i agree this was staged. i always expected them to fold. not shocked at all. in fact surprised they lasted this long. they are not fighters anymore. been in DC too long. lost touch with the people. and schumer is milk toast thru and thru.
We just have to stay energized, inspired and creat the biggest bluest most progressive tsunami we can next year. Let these milquetoast senators not halt what has started - and accelerated last week!
The working D group was more like 12.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/handful-of-senate-democrats-join-gop-to-break-funding-stalemate-first-step-toward-ending-shutdown
A road map on how to demoralize your base. Show some fight (finally) only to completely cave and get nothing. Makes us feel like this was orchestrated from the start, that it was all theater. They knew they would just cave but wanted our energy, our money and our votes in the meantime. The fact that there is exactly 60 votes for this cloture proves that this was completely orchestrated by leadership. Apparently they think we are stupid.
For the life of me, I don't get how they do not understand that inflating expectations with a lot of "fight" talk to then cave in the end in what apparently was likely an orchestrated foregone conclusion. This deflates enthusiasm in the base more than just voting for cloture in the first place. All the while getting bombarded for more and more campaign contributions, multiple requests a day.
Here’s another suggestion: send some money to John Ossoff, who’s actually up for reelection next year and DID NOT cave, unlike the cowardly and politically foolish Dems that did.
You can give to Ossoff through Hopium here - https://www.hopiumchronicles.com/p/lets-get-to-work
Just donated to Ossoff for the third time. It did me good.
I've also contributed to Ossoff, thanks to Simon's suggestions and the link.
Good idea.
Just gave ! Felt good to give to a courageous person !
None of the Democrats (and one Independent - King) is up for re-election in 2026. Two are retiring after this current term.
I send a small amount $15 monthly to Ossoff and was going to pull it if he went with the Cavers. Grateful he did not and have emailed him so, given the very purple nature of his State.
OK, I've been awake now for about 4 hours and have had a little time to absorb this news. I guess where I stand is where I've stood since the Senate voted for reconciliation in the Spring. Now, more than ever, I feel that Senate Democrats need to vote for a leadership change ASAP. Not only has the leadership been unable to hold the caucus together, they've actively led us to this moment. Schumer (among others) voted for reconciliation, and Durbin was among last night's group of eight. This simply can not continue if we hope to maintain an energized electorate. Millions of people like me fought long and hard for last Tuesday's result, and we deserve leadership in the mold of a Churchill or Roosevelt, not Chamberlain.
Schumer came out against it. So there is that. Unfortunately he’s not as effective a whip like Pelosi was. We will see how the next few months go though…
Hi Jon. Durbin is the whip and is retiring. Given that his clock is ticking down, I feel that he should simply step aside for the good of the caucus. As for Schumer, he's the face of the Senate Democratic caucus. And, for better or (mostly) worse, and the optics here are simply awful.
durbin's whip -ha!
schumer leader- not!
just a week ago the people's voice mattered
It only took 1 week & 7 Sen Dems to inflict chaos in our united front to stand up for keeping ACA, SNAP, Medicaid benefits, fight against tyranny, corruption, rule of law, expansion of ICE, our neighbors and their children being physically abused and/or disappeared, etc etc...feel free to add to the list--
I agree that he should. The optics, at least among the base, aren't good and the point of having experienced legislators like Schumer and Durbin in the party doesn't help if they can't fight either (at the same time, just having a fighter isn't going to work either...they need no kidding experience but that's another convo for another time).
As for the "normie" American voter though, that I'm not worried about in this case. They're not as online as we are and they will blame the incumbent party for their suffering as they've done so many times, most recently last Tuesday as they had in 2024.
Hi Jon. I agree with what you've written, but I also feel that we're living in a unique moment, when people who typically stay on the sidelines know that they need to get out this time around. I'll put myself forward as an example. I'm (mostly) a high information voter, but I'm not terribly comfortable going out to protest. That all changed this year. I certainly won't speak for the 7+ million people who protested a few weeks ago, but I don't think that yesterday's maneuver by the 8 Senators is going to cause many of us to fold up our tents and go away!
Yep! I'm AD military though so I'm a bit more careful about what I participate in, and what I don't, but i completely agree.
We do have to remember that we the terminally politically online aren't necessarily representative of the American voter writ large. And the good thing about midterms next year is that the local candidate counts too, and that helps stave off the damage.
I agree with you. This is the first time in a long time that the American people have been mobilized to defend their country and the institutions upon which it was founded. What I experienced at the marches was solidarity and determination in the face of cruelty, abuse, and deceit.
While I agree most are not as plugged in as some are here, narrative and perception matters. At social events such as showers, coffee get togethers, etc. I hear over and over how the Dems are weak and what’s the point in fighting bc they will just fold. While I don’t say oh that’s not true, because that is what they believe and I don't want to dismiss it, I do say, we have to keep voting. Last week was an enormous boost. Yesterday, was demoralizing. While most may continue to vote, will they be energized enough to believe in the Party and protest and volunteer? More importantly, will they try to get their friends and family to believe and act? Will new voters continue to vote? Huge step backwards. I won't give up and most of us here won't. Schumer just made it harder. I, honestly, believe it's time for him and others who are not up to current challenges to step down. I hope Schumer resigns in a digniied manner. JMO
Honestly, this just caused me more frustration (and anger). IF Schumer was truly against it, then he can't hold his caucus together. If he thought he could fool most of us by voting no into thinking he wasn't behind this, he is sorely mistaken. I am in the latter category.
I don't think he actually can hold his caucus like Pelosi or other past leaders could. This is one of those "Hanlon's Razors" moments where Schumer doesn't mean ill, but isn't effective here.
Hard to match Pelosi, who had the guts to fend off an insurrection at 80 in two-inch high heels. Now that is a profile in courage.
LBJ was masterful as Senate leader; Harry Reid was better at holding the Dems together than Schumer.
Pelosi stood up to those in Obama's circle that did not want him to fight for the ACA. She knew it risked her Speakership but pushed forward anyway. At least, that is what has been written about it. Harry Reid also fought for the ACA.
Okay, I just had time to look up what "Hanlon's Razor's" means. Ahhhh:
"Hanlon's Razor is an adage that states, 'Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity'. It is a reminder to consider incompetence, error, or carelessness as the cause of a negative event before assuming the person acted with malicious intent".
Interesting theory, hmm. I don't think Schumer is stupid but I see your point here. AI went on to explain further but that was the gist of the explanation. I think Schumer is just not the right person/Senator to lead for this time in history.
Schumer voting no is performance art at its height. The 8 were choreographed, clearly.
Agree 100%. Durbin is the Whip for the Democratic Caucus. He is not voting for this unless Schumer allowed him to do so (he’s the number 2 leader of the caucus and is not going to undermine the leader for a vote of this magnitude). Also, they did this on a Sunday because they knew it would infuriate the base but viewed that as an acceptable cost for whatever goal they were seeking (and sought to bury the vote on a slow news day). I’m the same age as Simon and actually worked in the Senate (as an LA) and have been involved in Congressional issues for many years afterwards. I say this because I think Simon is right that Durbin and the others are by no means corrupt personally but I will say it is very likely they were heavily influenced by lobbyists and consultants in their decision making (and valued that input over the concerns of Democratic voters) and there is something pretty wrong, and corrupt, in that calculus and it is a reason for a change.
Thanks for your perspective from the "inside," Lojo. I just got done talking with a friend who also strongly feels that Schumer had to be part of the decision making process here. Anyway, both my friend and I are righteously displeased and feel more determined than ever to move forward to see the change we need to put this lunacy in the rearview mirror. And, for us, that means both winning future elections AND real change in the party to a leadership that, at the very least, comprehends the will of the voters a mere 5 days after a wave election!!!
I agree it was choreographed. However I would submit that Schumer likely had support from more than the 8. The 8 could take the heat because they were retiring or not up for re-election. I would bet there were others who supported the deal but did not want to face the backlash, which would have come.
Also Matthew Yglesias (Slow Money) thinks a lot of this was about preserving the filibuster
In any case, the Dems were pushed by us to do something they didn’t want to do, and made a point , and were not blamed like they feared
As Simon mentioned, more fights ahead and something to build on
I think people are really angry with most of it directed at Schumer.
Thank you. Well said.
Yes, state what we are for very completely. Another aspect, part of what came up re: unrolling the tariffs, is some outline of how we disassemble the corruption. On the legal side there's plenty of excellent discussion - top notch legal minds laying out what must be done - but for the government as a whole, how to we get there from here, and by getting there I mean build back better, as it were. Knowing one or several paths ahead will be a big help, imo.
one of my slogans: frogs united to help friends in other ponds
Yes the Dems let us down. Yes we are angry. But let's not forget that the difference between Schumer supporting the CR in March and the longest shutdown in history was We the People standing up and demanding that Dems fight. They did fight, up to a point, and not far or hard enough. But we made progress. Now we must push Dems (and Rs where possible) even harder. In all likelihood we will be back here in December over the ACA and in January over the budget. We have to keep fighting and keep demanding that Dems do MUCH better.
I think the concern being expressed extensively today is that the "fight" was pure theater. That the Democratic leadership knew that, in the end, they would just cave and vote for cloture and reopen the government. I guess some of us are questioning the sincerity of the "fight" that leadership was demonstrating.
That's ridiculous. Trump starting shooting the hostages, something that I am sorry was not a given at the beginning of this fight.
You know the town better than I do, so I'll take your word for it. I'm not sure the observation is ridiculous, however. There is, unfortunately, a history of not putting up much of a fight on these matters, including earlier this year. Leadership knew they had to "show" some determination this time around. Orchestrating a tidy end to the shut down after a very strong Democratic performance last week, to me, is a bit baffling. Which leads me to the conclusion that they possibly were using the energy of the shutdown for base politics without the resolve to truly take heat when the going got tough and continue to fight for what they said they were fighting for.
I agree with you, Simon, that they didn't intend this to be performative. The best proof of that (to me) is that there was real risk to the Dems of doing what they did, risks no one would take just to be performative, eg (1) It was all too easy to paint the Dems as responsible for the shutdown--it was clearly their Senate votes that were responsible (just as, in the past, GOP votes were deemed the culprit by the public)--and significantly harder to logically make the claim (to the less engaged who represent the balance of power) that the GOP was to blame; (2) It was all too easy for the GOP to tar the Dems as hypocrites given that every past shutdown, all of which the GOP was blamed for, originated from the GOP's refusal to pass clean CRs, which they would now be doing as well (3) They knew the GOP had a huge informational advantage in making their case, not only by virtue of having the guy who dominates every news cycle, but a guy they had to know would be willing to break any and every law to enhance that advantage (eg by violating the Hatch Act on every government website), and a corporate media that has been in the tank for him at every level--national, state, and local--since he descended that escalator in 2015 (4) These risks were turbocharged by the fact that they were making the decision to fight against the backdrop of a series of rapidly approaching elections that were must-win for us, not so much for them (ie they had to know the GOP would be able to dismiss losses in all the highest profile contests as taking place in "blue states and blue cities," and that our ill-informed electorate would have no reason to dismiss their dismissal).
For many of the same reasons, I believe we can't really dismiss the decision to "cave" as venal rather than heartfelt (if mistaken) either. We won the elections handily; the public had clearly decided the Republicans were to blame for the shutdown; the pressure on the eight, if any, was to stay the course, not to give in; none of eight were up for re-election in 2026, two of the eight were retiring. If they say they couldn't deal with the pain being inflicted on innocent people any more, that not only has to be considered the gospel truth, but even at least somewhat refreshing, given the history of our politics since Newt stormed into the Speaker's chair. It might even, outside our base, restore a little faith that at least some of our politicians actually care about the people as something more than vehicles for scoring political points, and a less cynical American public is not only important for America, but for the world, which has long relied on our can-do spirit.
All that said, I find myself wondering how and why the Dems in the Senate didn't anticipate that Trump would start "shooting the hostages," as you put it. I guess maybe I'm spoiled by how far ahead of them *you've* been since Day 1 of Trump 2, and because I've learned from you--we all have--that when it comes to Trump, to expect even worse than you can imagine, as well as how critical it is to understand how high the stakes are--we're not in a territory where we can be cute; the winner vs loser is a uniquely American dynamic inherent to the self-selection process that brought us here (which, until you took the risks *you* did in 2022, only the GOP seemed to understand), and strong vs weak is *always* the table stakes in the fight between autocracy and democracy.
For me personally, what you've taught about this in an American context has resonated down to the marrow, as the son of a father who grew up under Hitler and Stalin, and the grandson of a core minister in Boenhoffer's Confessing Church who got thrown in prison for preaching against Hitler during the war.
Any thoughts on why *they* didn't have a plan B? Fortunately, as another member put it, you're already giving us our own ways to make lemonade from these unusually sour lemons. :)
I’m not sure how much sincerity matters here. It seems clear that many Republicans in congress are not sincere in their support of Trump. It is expedient. If we can make it expedient for Dems to fight a lot harder for us by showing that they will lose elections if they don’t I think I can accept that.
Yeah that’s a go-to narrative that we all just have to be ready for. “Dems are performative” is a trope that gets trotted out at every opportunity. Watch out for 🇷🇺 in the comments out there (not on Hopium, but like, you know, social media in general).
Well, I'm not on conventional social media and I am not Russian. Providing my own opinions based on how things played out.
Fetterman constituents here and have been furious for some time and been contacting his voicemail. What can PA patriots do about him in particular? We did not vote for a Manchin in our state.
Fetterman loves going rogue, and unfortunately I thought that trait meant he would stand up to authoritarianism. Clearly I was wrong. He goes rogue to go rogue. I send vibes into the universe for him to retire so we can have an early election and get a fighter in there. I feel your frustration and disgust, and in spite of these emotions I will continue to call and demand courage in the face of this regime.
Great observation. Do you think we could somehow give the teenager something else to rebel against besides the Dem party?
Ok, I am disappointed, and I have grown children who are not getting paid. I think Shummer has to go.
Dick Durbin certainly needs to
I believe I’m done with the Democratic Party … even Abigail Spanberg’s comments yesterday were disappointing..
People need to go easy on Spanberger.
Trump's assault on federal workers in this region has been savage all year and people hurting here, terribly. People have been fired. Their lives wildly disrupted. And now folks aren't getting paid. The entire region has been under assault and imagine missing three paychecks on a government salary. We now have the highest unemployment rate in the country, the national guard is patrolling our streets, etc.
To add to Simon's point, I worked the polls last week here in Arlington, VA (a very affluent neighborhood) and all I heard from the folks who wanted to talk was about the Shutdown. How it affected their neighbors -- pointing to houses down the street -- their friends, their friends' kids, and even themselves. Some of us can bear this, but many cannot. As someone said, people need to be paid and be fed. I guess that's what we have to think about....despite my previous post above -- I am still very disheartened.
I find the Democrats' (the 8 of them)action so hard to believe, to accept. But I have two other thoughts. I know Tim Kaine to be intelligent, thoughtful and reasonable. He must have had a good reason to vote as he did. Second, regardless we can't give up. We still have our huge victory on Election Day. That is what we need to remember and we need to keep fighting.
Virginia - I also admire Tim Kaine and saw a clip of him last night explaining his vote. I'm disappointed too, and had it been up to me, we would have held our ground. The truth is that it wasn't up to any of us, it was up to our elected representatives and a small number of them broke with the caucus to do what they felt was best. It feels like a betrayal this morning, but we have to move on knowing that kids will be fed, people will get their paychecks and there will be more hills to die on before we win at least the House back in 26. We must claim the win for being the adults in the room who ended the shutdown and move on to the next battle. My random thoughts - and I understand others' anger. Kent
I agree 100%, Kent! Claim this as a win, and if we repeat that message enough, people will believe it!
Have we learned nothing from tRumpy’s rules of “dominating the other side” after all these years?
And what will we do the next time the Republicans pull a fast one like this? It is transparently obvious that Trump knows he can push at least some of the Democrats over the brink by simply acting as illegally and cruelly as he has done here. Does anyone think that Republicans will vote to restore SNAP funding and extend the ACA premium subsidies, now that they’ve gotten essentially every thing they wanted? Why should they? They know that whenever they want to they can put the screws to the Democrats and the American people, and expect that some Democrats will fold again, just like they did in March and now in November.
I don't expect MAGA to ever do the right thing or to honor their promises. I wouldn't have caved if I had been there. But they did, so we may as well look forward and focus on how we message this. (We can also decide to primary anyone we want to, plan for winning next November, and fight them again in January when the CR comes up again.)
We just had some hugely major wins on our scoreboard. Huge. Massive. Wins that show the mind of the voters. Wins that have immense value. The alarm has been sounded. Even the rural states have become engaged. Now we work together for more and more of these. For more exposing of this regime. The alternative is unacceptable. IMO we focus our anger on our opponents who are damaging our democracy. We focus our anger on protecting our democracy for our children and grandchildren.
I feel betrayed. And I’m not alone. ‘We the People’ held up our end. We called, we wrote, we contributed, we rallied and we voted. We sent a crystal clear message to Washington and to our elected representatives that we won’t cave to a king.
Then 8 of them sold us out.
For the first time in almost a year we had some leverage, we held the cards and we folded.
Once again the old adage that Democrats bring pillows to gun fights applies and it’s true.
I feel so adrift today. I hate MAGA and I’m pissed as hell at Democrats. For the first time in almost 2 years I feel like quitting.
I’m hoping someone (you Simon?) can find a way to put lipstick on this pig.
This morning one of the major headlines read:
“Democrats are divided.”
And this comes not a week after we voted unanimously up and down ballot in unity!
My hair is on fire!!!!!
I hope you don't quit Judy. Our party is large, messy and a big tent. Personally, I'm pissed at this too - as are the house democrats - but remember this is but one battle. With new leadership will come more "fighters" we all want in our party. As for the "Dems" are divided headline, what else did you expect from corporate media ?
I appreciate your support. But in this case I don’t think the headlines are wrong. Go to Dick Durban’s FB page and read the responses. Just one example of many left leaning pages. We shouldn’t have to be clawing back support with Democratic constituents. I think that’s gonna suck up a lot of energy better spent elsewhere.
My point was we don't have to remain in disarray.
Correct. "Dems in Disarray" is a media/ Repub meme. We should NOT buy into it.